Feeding and Nutrition :: Shell deformities...

[ryecatcher773]

Well, I was just looking at pics of shell rot online (it turns out that Joffrey doesn't have shell rot, it's just some rubbing on top of his shell from playing under the new floating log, so that's a relief)...

However, I've just discovered that what I always thought was just a variation in shell patterns on Jalapeno, is actually symptomatic of being overfed.

He has the sort of jagged fringed edges of his scutes and the little trident pattern behind his head (so it looks like there's the one prong right behind his head). He seems perfectly happy and playful otherwise, and Joffrey doesn't have the same problem at all (he looks pretty smooth actually). And it just sort of occurred to me that Jalapeno is the bigger pig of the two, even though they were hatch lings together and are currently almost the exact same size.

Any idea how I can get this situation under control? I imagine that it will take a while -- assuming of course that it's at all possible -- but I don't feed them every day anymore like I used to. They have minnows swimming around so they can hunt (the minnows have plants and places to hide so a dozen last a LOT longer than they used to before we switched to a bigger aquarium).

Any advice is appreciated. Thanks.

[megcornell]

If you could post shell pictures that would be helpful.
From what you've described it sounds like your turtles are showing more signs of retained scutes than signs of pyramiding.
It's excellent that you've gotten their diets under control. Overfeeding proteins can really damage a turtle's shell.
Have you taken a look at the nutrition sticky notes to see what vegetables are great to feed? RES can eat veggies daily and it's a great way to balance their diets. In your case items high in vitamin E like blueberries and apple skins are great because they help turtles shed their scutes.
Another important aspect of shell health is proper lighting. Do you have a UVB light?

With proper basking and diet, your turtles should start the shed those retained scutes. If they've started pyramiding there's nothing you can do to "undo" the damage but a balanced diet will certainly prevent any further damage and with time and growth the pyramiding will become less noticeable.

[marisa]

The jagged marginal scutes sound like he's been overfed, perhaps too much protein. And, if by "prong" behind the head you're referring to the nuchal scute, watch for signs that it isn't cutting into or rubbing on his neck. Is Jalepeno fed with Joffrey, and if so, does he take more of the food? what exactly is the diet like?

What kind of UVB light are you using?

If you can, post a pic of the shell dry.

[ryecatcher773]

The jagged marginal scutes sound like he's been overfed, perhaps too much protein. And, if by "prong" behind the head you're referring to the nuchal scute, watch for signs that it isn't cutting into or rubbing on his neck. Is Jalepeno fed with Joffrey, and if so, does he take more of the food? what exactly is the diet like?

What kind of UVB light are you using?

If you can, post a pic of the shell dry.

Yeah, that's exactly what I mean -- the nuchal scute. Actually, the user on here that goes by the name 'Novroz' has an avatar that shows exactly what Jalapeno's nuchal scute looks like. It doesn't appear that he's got the pyramiding thing going on -- just a sawtooth sort of edge around his outermost shell.

(I'd post a pic, but the camera is currently out of commission)

I just switched light fixtures with the new 90 gallon... so the old UVB wasn't anything to brag about... and I say this because when I picked up the new UVB fixture (this time I spent the extra $ and bought a Exo-Terra rig with UVB bulbs) I noticed the price was quite different -- even though Exo-Terra prices seems to run higher than those of other brands.

Diet-wise, they both eat together, but I'd say that Jalapeno seems to be more aggressive (or maybe it's just more attentive). When they were smaller, I fed them more often than I do now. Mainly, their diet consists of pellets (Zoo Med 'Natural Aquatic Turtle Food' -- Growth Formula for turtles 2-6", 35% Protein), Ruby Reds (which they eat as they catch them... with the new tank, there's plenty of undergrowth for the minnows to hide, so a dozen last a lot longer), and occasionally crickets and superworms as treats (we have a Leopard Gecko, so we've always got those things on-hand). Unfortunately, I've had virtually no luck with veggies (tried carrots, peas, lettuce, and yesterday I tried blueberries).

One last dietary note: Jalapeno doesn't seem to eat the cuttle bone like Joffrey does... which has always concerned me.

Thanks for any assistance you can provide. It's greatly appreciated.

[marisa]

That's really quite a high-protein diet....If you can, get some anachris (an aquatic plant). Most turtles like it, and it can be a good way to get them used to the idea of eating plant matter.

[ryecatcher773]

Actually, they have made a meal of the Anacharis whenever I put it in... but it used to clog the old filter intake, so I stopped in favor of fake plants.

The new setup has some custom mods to the new filter (I used PVC piping with holes drilled in it for the intake, so it won't clog now). I'll try some live plants again.

Thanks for the advice. I'll certainly cut down on the protein.