Urgent Care :: Kidney and liver failure

[Rhana]

I was hoping someone out there might have some experience with kidney/liver failure in red eared sliders. I have a female, approximately 20 year old who I took to the vet because she was climbing out of her pond and burrowing under towels. She stays burrowed pretty much all the time now and only goes in the water when I put her in. This has been going on for about two weeks now. In the 13 years I have had her, she has never done this before. She has been laying eggs for about 8 years now. I got worried that she may be egg bound. An X-ray revealed no eggs and the doctor said she would be acting much sicker than she was if the eggs had broken inside her. He put her on baytril injections for 10 days just in case she was suffering from an infection. After the treatment began I noticed that she was putting off a very strong, unusual smell. The vet said he thought her kidneys were shutting down and a blood test has confirmed that her kidneys and liver are not functioning properly. My vet has advised me to still not give up hope and has given me a vitamin paste to give her that is supposed to improve liver health. He also advised another 10 days of baytril injections. I have not been able to do these injections at home and have been taking her in every day to get them. This is stressful for both of us. Please, does anyone know if there is any real chance of recovering from kidney and liver damage? im happy to do whatever I can to give her a chance but friends and family are softly trying to tell me that this is a cruel extension of her life. Whenever I bring up euthanasia with my vet, he says to not give up on her yet. I'm so unsure of what to do.

[steve]

Is this vet a herp vet? "Broken eggs" inside her is a pretty wild guess in my opinion. Eggs are usually very pliable to prevent breaking and to make laying easier. If it had calcified, that would show up clearly on the x-rays. Baytril is a pretty good medication, though there are newer antibiotics on the market. If she is still eating you can try an oral form of Baytril, though most antibiotics can suppress appetite.

Is there any swelling or bloating with her? Kidney damage is often related to diet issues. What are the water temperatures?

[Rhana]

He is not specifically a herp vet but he sees all types of animals. I have not seen any swelling. She is still eating but I have to physically put her in the water to entice her. She gets out immediately afterwards and returns to her towel borrow and doesn't move until I pull her out again. I increased her water temp to 85. Right now I have isolated her from my other slider. I read that Baytril injections can lead to kidney damage and I didn't notice the odd smell on her until she had been on the medication for several days. I am worried that the baytril could be contributing to her kidney failure. My vet wants me to continue with it, however. My concern is that he put her on Baytril without really knowing what the problem was. He said it was the basic treatment for most turtle problems so we should start there. So, is it wise to keep her on it if it could be causing damage and we're not really sure if she needed it in the first place? If I adjust her diet, can she actually recover from kidney failure? I definitely don't want to give up on her but I also dont want to prolong any suffering. I would be happy to take her somewhere for a second opinion and have contacted several local turtle societies for a recommendation. So far, I have not gotten any response.

[steve]

I don't think Baytril is very potent but an overdose of any medication will cause problems. Kidney damage is not reversible but is treatable in certain situations as I understand it. I would personally take her to an experienced herp vet. Where are you located?

[Rhana]

Redlands, California. Do you know of any specialists in the southern california area?

[steve]

The main turtle group there is California Turtle and Tortoise Club. They have different charters listed here: http://www.tortoise.org/cttc/member.html and according to their group page, they meet this Friday.

CTTC Inland Empire Chapter - Meets: First Friday of the month, 7:30 pm at "The Ark" Church of the Nazarenes in the Fellowship Hall in Young Hall located at 1307 East Citrus Ave, Redlands, CA 92374.

I do not know if this is up to date, if they are knowledgable, if you want to wait, or if you're interested in this group at all (many turtle/tortoise keepers are not RES-friendly) but keep looking around in case. Maybe even shoot a message to Turtle Rescue Long Island for their opinion (they're not in your location but deal with a lot of different issues): https://www.facebook.com/TurtleRescueLongIsland